It pains me to see Devra so vilified in the G+ threads, though I do not myself find an easy exculpatory explanation.
It pains me to see Devra so vilified in the G+ threads, though I do not myself find an easy exculpatory explanation. Let us give her the benefit of the doubt for a moment and think of what she might know that she is not telling that would explain this. At this point, the anti-Devra denigration operation is having devastating success.
Oh, ok... hmph ;-)
ReplyDeleteSo trust Devra but not Susanna?
ReplyDeleteTrust is in short supply, I assume. I think all can be trusted for somethings and distrusted for others. But that is just my philosophy.
ReplyDeleteThere's two things I'd want clarified.
ReplyDelete1) Is she advocating never uniting the shards in a single location, regardless of which side does it? If not, can she explain why uniting the shards in Buenos Aires would be different than uniting them at Cupid's Span?
2) What was the result of her Visur research that she told Hank was so terrible. This, to me, would shed light on all aspects of her plans. If she cannot reveal it due to obligations to Visur, she should explore means of leaking the information. It's been done before. After all, if the future of humanity is at stake, what's a NDA?
Interesting
ReplyDeleteAn NDA is a non-disclosure agreement. It creates extreme liability for anybody who breaches it and divulges secrets. In the case of an NDA with the NIA, I think their enforcement mechanisms are quite robust.
ReplyDeleteAnd the whole story of Ingress is one of evading such. Hell, if there's anyone who could do it and get away with it, it's ADA. Why doesn't she?
ReplyDeleteAnother question that we'd like to see answered is (and I'm one of the ones who likes to give her the benefit of the doubt) what is the nature of her "vaccine" against XM and how was it tested/developed?
ReplyDeleteIf there's something that she knows... Something that is putting, or can prevent putting, the whole of Humanity at risk... NDA and NIA be damned. Yesterday of all days should've reminded us that sometimes sacrifices have to be made for the greater good.
ReplyDeletePerhaps I have a slightly jaded and biased mentality due to my Veteran status, but... Damnit, I can't work in the dark. As a military member, as an Agent, as a human being. There's something she knows that she's willing to put herself out there as a pariah, asking the CDC to inoculate the world against XM, despite the wall she had to know she'd run into as a scientist.
I can neither completely trust nor distrust her, because I don't have all the information. Such is why I signed on for Operation Essex: in hopes to find some sort of truth through the lies, the shadow-tossing... But even here, now, we're having the debate about Devra's 'game'.
A riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma potentially attached to a ticking time-bomb. This does not make me comfortable.
Ok giving Derva the benefit of the doubt, perhaps she know that if the shards are reunited that's when the virus will be released, thus the need for her preemptive leaked? discussion with CDC
ReplyDeleteDavid Timothy Giving reference to the video of her in the park with Hank, she said that she had been exposing unknowing subjects to XM under the orders/while working with Visur. The nature of the vaccine is still unknown in what it contains or how it affects a person either in physical or mental states. While it does help to give the benefit of the doubt, it still is a concept to be worried about.
ReplyDeleteI have a hard time imagining any information that could justify global treatment using an untested vaccine under false pretenses. That said, there is value in speculating on what she may be holding back. There are many areas that Devra has studied but not shared information about.
ReplyDeleteThe first is the XM carrier wave or dialtone signal that carries ordered information. Devra has hinted that the signal can be seen to change based on variant manifestation of sensitive enhancement. Are the sensitives the origin of that change, or is there a remote force targeting them spcifically? Is that outside force using the ordered data to change the subjects' behavior as well as their abilities? Has there been some recent change to the nature of the dialtone signal that by all other indicatin appears to be inherent background noise of human civilization. Are all humans capable of sensing and manipulating XM, or only sensitives? What allows the sensitives to detect and manipulate XM?
What of glyphs? Visual or auditory stimuli have been shown to trigger reactions in some observers, and sequences can form relatively complex commands with which the human mind can be programmed. Can glyphs effect matter directly, or only the mind? Is it possible that humanity could have evolved these trigger centers naturally, or is the presence of glyph triggers evidence that homo sapiens has been engineered for that sensitivity? What could justify the assertion that the Cassandra sequence was a self destruct code, and what could Carrie Campbell's suicide have had to do with thwarting the damage? We need some mechanism to prove that the code was not simply harmless and the suicide unrelated to society's failure to collapse.
Is Chaotic matter the same phenomenon as XM or some entirely separate substance? Can it be created or must sources be discovered? Is it simply XM without any carrier signal to order it? If so, can it be reordered after the disruption? Why has it not been a threat in the past, and can we control the sources rather than subject humanity to untested medication?
How about the scanner's origin? Why was the blue resonance frequency chosen in the initial scanner? Does that frequency allow any human agency to alter the dialtone signal beneath its effects? Who now controls the XM collection network once used by the CERN team? How are changes to the scanner code and Xm construct blueprints inserted into the network?
I am confident Devra could answer many of these questions if she chose to.
It seems strange that the Resistance wants to reunite the shards in order to prevent the Enlightened from reuniting the shards. Does it really matter to Jarvis how he is reassembled? These anomalies keep bringing me back to "pyrrhic victory", one of PA's words of the day (6.30).
ReplyDeleteAnother curiosity is these two statements:
"...Portals occur in places of artistic, cultural, or historic significance. We believe this has been the case for humans of all nationalities and cultures, throughout recorded history..."
"...the XM Scanner slipped into private hands and was released to the public as a ‘game’ called Ingress. As a result, the XM scanner was widely disbursed and we are left to deal with the effects of XM exposure on hundreds of millions of people..."
If humans have always been exposed to XM, how does the presence or lack of a scanner influence this in any way?
http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/pac/IB/01/item/truth.html
Maybe it's not the XM itself she is worried about, but something specific she witnessed during Epiphany Night. Something Jarvis was drawn to but she was repulsed by.
That much is nearly certain. We know, from Jarvis' exclamation, "It's the mainstem; it's enlightenment" that he saw something extraordinary.
ReplyDeleteOn one hand, she seems to have a sort of "sure, whatever" attitude. On the other hand, she wants to get out "before they lock it down", which sounds like maybe she saw something too important to stay buried.
ReplyDeleteThat's the interesting part of it, Jim Typhoon. I assume that they both saw the exact same thing before that surveillance recording but they interpreted it very differently... Devra looked for the simplest rational explanation while Jarvis read into it his hopes and dreams. It's time Jarvis takes off his rose-colored glasses, though in his current state those hopes and dreams are all he has left having lost his humanity.
ReplyDeleteOr, alternately, Devra let her fear get the best of her (something she has done on multiple occasions) and she needs to step past it and realize the nature of what she saw.
ReplyDeleteMike Wissinger chose to? Perhaps there is something keeping her from answering. Sometimes we don't have a choice to do what we want.
ReplyDeleteWhen on the run, one often does things from a sense of self preservation and with very short sighted reasoning. IN a way, I'm not sure Devra has stopped running since Epiphany Night. I wonder if she has ever truly felt safe. Going all the way back to Maslow, if the basics are not satisfied, one can not move to other functions. There is a saying, fight or flight... perhaps Devra has become tired of running and is trying to fight, albeit in a short sighted sense, but, if she is suffering from other issues, then perhaps treating those issues can help her refocus. Along with that, sometimes when a person is tired and run down, they have to fall back on a deep core, what is that core?
ReplyDeleteShe has chosen to propose a radical, dangerous course that could poison everyone on the planet. Surely that merits an ironclad case being made to justify it.
ReplyDeleteI'm sympathetic to her state of mind, and I'm sure she believes she has good reason for her recent proposals, but she hasn't come anywhere close to making a case commensurate with the proposal. I'm not asking for her to be jailed, as most of the horrible outcomes we've seen (like the experiments under Pevtsov's employ) were made under duress. I simply don't think we should go along with whatever she demands simply because she might know something she isn't saying.
If she says what she knows, how she learned it, and why her scheme is the best (or only) solution to the problem she could change a lot of minds.
Rory Durkin "If humans have always been exposed to XM, how does the presence or lack of a scanner influence this in any way?"
ReplyDeleteEnergy levels and range of effect. Even the most influential, the most moving pieces of artwork, the busiest cultural and political centers, and the sites of the most important events of history only leak in a small handful of XM into our world and only in the immediate vicinity of the portal.
It was Dr. Lynton-Wolfe being inspired on how to form XM into constructs using his scanner tech, and specifically, how to make resonators, that is the key to all this. By attuning a portal to a certain frequency and polarization, it also increases the amount of XM blobs that portal spills into our world. And once you start linking portals into control fields, you begin to project laboratory-grade levels of diffuse XM dose much further than the portal's natural influence would ever reach.
Do you have suggestions Edgar Allan Wright for how to perhaps pull Devra to talk more?
ReplyDeleteYes, good idea JoJo Stratton. We really just want to hear from her and perhaps Edgar Allan Wright can facilitate that.
ReplyDeleteEdgar Allan Wright Could we invite Devra Bogdanovich to this community? We are all willing researchers, perhaps we could help with her studies. I know Dr. Bogdanovich I would be very willing to help you in studying more the research you have started to help better understand really what we are dealing with.
ReplyDeleteSometimes just talking out ideas and potential theories is what is needed. I know I do a lot of wild speculation (as those in this and other communities know LOL) it is a safe place to just dream and create and invite and explore. Nothing to run from, nothing to demand of you, just that wonderful feeling of open dialogue and sincere desire to know and listen.
It's a safe zone Devra Bogdanovich
Rory Durkin are you suggesting Devra won't want in once she sees Dr Wright is the community owner? Maybe JoJo will need to create her own research community.
ReplyDeleteOr join an existing one. Have you read the Journal Of XM Science? https://plus.google.com/communities/111830410128555780305
It seems they have some history, not necessarily positive; she may be open to conversation here but given that remark I think its far from certain.
ReplyDeleteThis is the first I've heard of the journal, thanks for the link.
ok - I am giving this another shot, but she just seems not to be talking - I hope it is because she just does not feel like it and not because she can't....
ReplyDeleteAny tima ANYBODY says they want to "innoculate" as large a population as possible in secret and without trials, I am doubious of yheir motivation. There are no indications as to what this innoculation is, but I can only guess that it involves flooding the planet with yet ANNOTHER type of XM.
ReplyDeleteWow, I am bad at typing on tablets... :/
ReplyDelete